strange puddles ???

Hello All! I am hopeing someone out there can help. Sometimes when our 4 yr. old female, gracie, takes a nap she "sweats" all around her back side. It's as if she is peeing on herself in her sleep, but it's a clear puddle and does not smell like pee (though it does have an odor). By puddle I mean it takes about 2 dish towels to soak it all up and her back side and hind legs are drenched. Any ideas?

Thanks in advance!
Brent, Cindy , & Gracie
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Hi there,

We have a 5/6 year old female sheepy and noticed the same thing. The vet said it's usually seen in older dogs, but our Abby is not that old. Nonetheless, she leaks. She now gets two pills a day of "Proin 50" chewable tablets, and they keep her from leaking. If we run out of them for a couple of days, the problem returns, so of course, we always keep a good supply.

Hope this helps,
Diane Doban
Our OES is 16 months old and has just started to leave puddles, in fact this is the very subject I was looking for today. I guess I will have to take her to the vet and see if there is a problem. This should not be happening to a dog this young I would think. It has just started in the last couple of weeks so I don't know if she may have a bladder infection. I don't think it is because she is not asking to constantly go out to pee.
Carver. :? :?
I talked with our vet about the very same subject when Maddie was less than 1 yr. He stated that it could be an infection and to bring in a fresh sample of urine that was collected first thing in the morning. With that sample he can tell if it is an infection or something else. He also said that somes times as a result of being syayed that these problems can arise and this is why we may see this in apuppy so young.

:) Hi this is Carver,
We went to the Vet and did the urine analisys and everything is good. He did however put my female Ginger on hormone pills. He said that spayed females will sometimes develop a incontinance problem after being spayed. We have had her on these pills for three days and have seen a remarkable improvement, infact today she has yet to piddle and we have our fingers crossed. I hope this will help in your delema it seems to be working for Ginger.

Good Luck!
Hi, I just thought I would write and say that Meg has this too. She has been to the vets and has had a thorough check up and has no problems health wise (she's 19 months old). She is presently unspayed and her sweat glands has been working overtime virtually from when we got her. Also when she is very hot, she leaves sweaty paw prints when she walks. So I think it is a oes dog trait. And nonething to worry about. Our shih tzu has this too - so I think it is more to do with heat - as this also happens in the winter due to central heating. (she also sweats through her bedding)
Honestly our house doesnt smell that much!! We have most of the doors and windows open as well as a extractor fan on to freshen the air. (I do go through tons of air fresheners!). Hope this helps
I just came here to find out why my dog was piddling on herself whenever she lies down. She's been doing it ever since she was spayed, but now it is an every day event.
I wonder why it is such a common problem? :?:
By the way, dogs don't sweat. That is why they pant so much. That is why they need lots of fresh water. to cool their tongue as much as to refresh themselves.
I've also seen much documentation saying that dogs don't sweat, save through thier paws and tongue.

Can anyone tell me why my Woof (9 months old, and male) leaves a wet patch on the tiling when he's been sleeping in the kitchen? It's not enough to be called a puddle, and it's certainly not pee, but it leaves his fur damp.....
my matie started leaking at 7 months...she was spayed at 6 months. she took 1 pill 2X per day for three months with no problem. the vet had me take her off and she didn't last but a day and a half. she will be on propalin her whole life...they said it is common in spayed large breed dogs. :(
My 3 1/2 year old, female, black lab went on Proin today. I've been looking all over the internet to find as much information as I could about it - it's nice to find others who are going through this "problem".

It actually doesn't even seem to be that much of a problem to. My mother's dog was a diabetic and we gave it 2 shots a day for several years - you just get used to it and the dogs don't seem to mind.

I see that bcf feels that matie will be on Proin her whole life and I wonder if that's true. I certainly believe that but I have yet to find any mention of that anywhere. Does anyone else have any experience with prolonged use of Proin or DES?

My vet said that after a while, you can cut the dosage down to 1 pill a day, then even a half of a pill or a quarter even. And someone online said they were down to 3 pills a week (Mon, Wed, Fri). It's just a matter of finding what will be enough to keep the incontinence from coming back.

Good luck everyone.
The vet here said that once Abbi was on the pills it would be for the rest of her life. It seems vets take out the ovaries when they "spay" dogs. The ovaries usually secrete estrogen and other hormones that keep the bladder muscles in good shape. It affects them immediately, but most dogs learn to clean themselves so their owners do not notice the first few years -- and it does take a while for the muscles to completely give out.

Vets will not leave the ovaries in because they say dogs get ovarian cancer and post-op infections in them. It is safer to take them out.

But it is not all that great for the poor dog who gets yelled at for "forgetting" is it? I wish they had told me this 3 years ago, when I had Abbi spayed.

Our vet says he has over half his female dogs on hormones and is wondering about it himeself. And he couldn't tell me why it affects the larger breeds more than the smaller ones, except they have bigger bladdres.

Dogs' urine will be clear and almost odorless if you are giving it enough water.
A dog will clean up small messes themselves, leaving a wet spot. Also, mine lies around drooling on the floor. And when she drinks, she drips water everwhere if you don't watch her. My children wipe her off after she drinks now because they don't want to worry about whether she's had an accident or has had a drink. Works for me!
I know this is and old post but I was doing a yahoo search for info about dogs and tofu (don't ask) and I came across this article about tofu and incontinance sp? It talks about tofu helping instead of hormones for older dogs that have leaking problems when sleeping or just waking.

you might want to discuss with it with your vet first of course
Wow. I have never seen this post before, nor have I ever heard about this problem before! That's awful! I can't believe so many of you have had this problem! Does anyone know if OES are more prone to it than other large breeds? At first I thought perhaps it was in relation to docking their tails. For dogs who have it ALL docked, not even leaving one or two vertebra, it can damage the nerves inside and cause incontinence. Has anyone had this problem when the dog is not spayed? Or only when spayed? And it seems there is one person who posted with this problem who has a male, not a female, so if it is a hormone problem in relation to ovaries why would this happen? Ovaries and testicles are essentially the same organs, but still... I'm very curious to hear more about this.... Makes me glad I don't plan on spaying my two girls.... although I had planned on spaying them later so I wonder if it will cause this problem then, or if they will have had those hormone producing organs long enough to develop the muscles better and avoid the problem?
By the way, my first OES was female, and I had her spayed at about a year and a half, as she was not the right dog to breed. I never had this or any other health problem with her. Maybe the answer is indeed waiting a bit longer to spay?
I'm happy to see so many people learning about this spay female thing. My vets says it is not limited to big dogs. Of 15 dogs in my life (so far) only one was a wet butt.....boy was she a wet butt! It took two different pills to even slow the leak. Eventually we ended up putting her in "diaper pants" for the last 3-4 years. The outer covering was denim and blended with her blue coat, LOL.

Soy and Tofu! Very interesting! I found early on my sheepies could not tolerate soy in any form.........they would pass "deadly" gas. This has eliminated many different dog foods and treats. I must read the label carefully or suffer the consequences. :lol:

Yes, I see this is an old post. But now I'm a little worried. I called my vet and they recommended that I spay Lola at 6months (and I heard it avoids other complications). So now I'm confused. Would it still be better to spay her at 6mos. or wait?
We got our westie called Meg spayed at 10 months and within about 2 weeks she started wetting herself when she was asleep. One day in the summer after a long walk she drank a full bowl of water and within a minute while she was stood up it just started pouring out of her, she was very distressed and didn't know why or could stop it happening. She is now on liquid propalin 3mls twice a day for life. I wish I'd never had her spayed now because i don't know if it will get worse when she's older or if she will become imune from the medicine and it stop working. Has anyone had this problem with dogs that have been on this alot of years? Our Meg is georgous and very loving she loves kids and is very playful we all love her to bits. Please be aware of this problem before you get your dog spayed. :? :?
When to spay is another of those "ask a million people" and you'll get a "million answers" to the question. I've had them spayed both before and after first heat and had the leaking problem with females who were spayed young and spayed older. One vet told me that it's a common occurance in females who have been spayed (both before and after 6 months) when they reach around 5 years of age. The physical problems of not spaying are much more dangerous. We took in two female OES rescues, age 10 and age 8 who had not been spayed. Both had an overabundance of uterine tumors..... One had cancer, the other didn't. We had another 6 year old rescue female who hadn't been spayed and she was fine. There is so much that can be figured into the problem...genetics, environment, diet that it's impossible to make a guess. All we can offer is previous experience. I now have one 10 year old female who has been on Proin (or an equivalent) for 5 years. She was spayed after her first heat. I have a 7 year old who doesn't have the "Leak" and she's a rescue so I don't know when she was spayed.
Another OES mystery that can only be solved by in depth breed specific research?
Actually, it would be a great topic for someone going after their Master's degree to use for a major thesis. That is how a lot of new findings come about, students looking to aquire a masters degree (in science) need to complete a thesis on something original, and need to contribute something to the scientific world. Perhaps this could be suggested to the Veterinary schools?
this is very interesting - I have never heard of this and when I brought Maggie in to be spayed the vet failed to meniton anything about this at all. Is there information out there relating directly to having females spayed or perhaps that is a coincidence??? has anyone been warned of this being a possilbe side effect after fixing your female?
Here's a site where you can read about it:
From what I've been told by Vets, it doesn't happen to every spayed female and therefore, they don't mention it as a possibility...I think they probably feel that NOT spaying harbors many more health risks vs. spaying.
I work for a veterinarian and also have a dog with urinary problems. Yes she leaves puddles. Unfortunately, it is at night while sleeping on our bed. There have been a few nights when we have had to change the sheets and do wash at 3 inthe morning.

Ok, this is the problem...she has a weak sphincter muscle and is on pills called Proin 50. This has been a big help and accidents now are rare. So, ask your vet about Proin. He or she may have something else.
We have an Airedale who is 10 years old. She started leaking within a few weeks of being spayed, so I guess this problem goes across a variety of breeds. She has been on Proin 50 ever since...about 9 years. She is down to 1/2 tablet twice a day and it seems to take care of the problem. As far as we know, it has caused no problems and has helped enormously with the leaking problem. We have noticed that it seems to get worse during hot weather. Perhaps this is because doggies drink more when heat stressed.
I have a 3 yr. old Yorkie (bigger size 17lb) that just started Proin today. It is 25mg. and she gets 1/2 tablet twice a day.

I have been reading up on dog inconsistency for quite awhile now as she has had the "leaking" problem. It is only when she is laying down sleeping or resting. Alot of the time it ends up on my leg. It was just starting to get to be more and more. Started out maybe once or twice a week, now is more like 4 x a day or more.

I called my vet and they wanted to rule out bladder infection and/or crystals. She has been on a special urinary dog food for approx. 8 months, but crystals were not the issue.

Although my vet said it was not common in younger dogs, they can have weak bladders (splinter muscles) after spaying.

For those of you wondering if spaying was the right choice I hope I can give you an example of not spaying.

My first dog Brandi (lived to be almost 16) was never spayed. At around 13 yrs. of age she started losing weight drastically (went from 12 lb. to 6 1/2 lb.). Would not eat, drank alot, etc.

Took her in and had blood work done. Vet was not sure, but he suspected infection of the uterus. He was not even sure she would make it through surgery thats how bad she was.

They did the surgery and ended up removing her uterus, spleen, and lymph nodes. Massive infection. She did make it through just fine, even acted like a pup again after recovery and had her for 3 more yrs.

So...if I would of had her spayed I most likely never would have gone through that. I think I would rather have a dog be on Proin then take the risk later on of losing them.

I have read many good things about Proin and hope it helps. I just hating having to have my dogs on meds the rest of her life since she is so young. But if it makes her feel better (yes, she feels bad when she wets) and keeps my couch, leg, floor, etc will be worth it.
Our first female OES had never any issues with urinary inconsistency. She was spayed at a very early age. Now, we have a brother and sister team. They both had health issues that were treated before we purchased them. Within a year, they received a clean bill of health. However, once our female turned 4 yrs. old, we noticed mostly wetness on her right hind quarters. At first, we thought she had either pulled a muscle or possibly developed a "stone" which caused her to urinate on herself. She was spayed at a later age. Our vet states that this is due to hormones and will need to be on meds for the rest of her life. She also has been placed on Proin 50. We would administered the meds from twice a day to only in the morning. With 100% success, I thought I would be able to stop the meds. We were dealing, at times, of issues of a reeking odor which even shampoo would not get the smell out. Now, we are back to piddling issues especially when she is mostly asleep. Is there another alternative?
Welcome to spay incontinence. It can happen following spaying at any age. A number of years ago NYS OES rescue placed a very healthy 11 year old bitch whom was spayed, as is policy, and within a few months she was incontinent and her new owners were not happy, even though it is usually very controllable. But, yes, the meds are typically for life, though you may be able to control the problem with less drugs over time.

Not all bitches go on to develop incontinence following spaying. I've spayed at age 3, 6 and 7 and so far so good. It's impossible to predict, but, as your vet correctly stated it is hormone related, i.e. due to a lack of hormones. Even though female dogs don't naturally go through menopause like female humans do, spaying them artificially creates a somewhat similar situation.

Now, the strong smell really isn't normal. You may want to collect a urine sample and have your vet check it to make sure she doesn't have a UTI or something like that.

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