Herding Question
One gentleman that heads one of the clubs near me, gave me the name of a man about an hour from us who is a member of the club and does have sheep on his farm. I spoke with him yesterday and he said he would be glad to let us come to his farm--but I am a little concerned that this may not be what I am looking for so I would like some opinions as I am not really familiar with how this all works. He says we can come to his farm and spend the whole day if we want. He charges only $8.00 for the day, but only gives about 15 to 20 minutes of instruction and then we are on our own. He said he has never worked with OES, just Border Collies. My question is this-- would only 15 to 20 minutes of instruction be enough for us to then know what we were doing to continue to work there for a bit. I am sure we would not stay the whole day, but would be interested in an hour or two. If anyone knows of a place here in Tennessee, or even Kentucky or Alabama, we would be willing to drive a bit for this. Is there a website that shows what exists in different states for herding? |
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Sorry I meant to get back to you on this.  I don't think 15-20 minutes instruction would be enough, especially since Border Collies usually have a very different approach to herding (though that's ok, my trainer is a working BC breeder, and she enjoys working with the different OES style). This does sound like a great way to get a lot of practice in, that's the main thing which slows my progression with Mady and Gracie, unlike agility and I'm sure most other dog sports, it's really hard to work on any of the training without having the sheep there! So I would definitely try this out and keep it available as a place to practice. I also wouldn't plan on practicing for more than an hour at a time. But even at $8/hour, this place would still be a real bargain. |
No, 15-20 minutes would not even begin to prepare you...sorry.  Does this person do classes?...meaning would there be others there for lessons that you could also watch? That would help. Just learning stock behavior is a big undertaking for the human, let alone learning to instruct your dog in any commands or skills. I would never, ever leave a 'town' person with no stock experience loose in an area with their dog and my sheep!  It just would be inviting disaster.AHBA (American Herding Breeds Assoc) has a link on their website - maybe someone is close to you? http://www.ahba-herding.org/MainPage.ph ... yDirectory  |
| Thanks David and Dawn!! You both confirmed my gut feeling. I will keep looking for some place to get the instruction we need, and maybe take this nice gentleman up on his offer and use his place for practice. He seems really nice but I really felt that his place was not the ideal situation for our first outing.  By the way David --it is only $8.00 for the whole DAY. Thanks Dawn for the link--I will check it out! |
| The American Herding Breed Association website might be helpful. Or you could come to a herding camp with us some time! We are doing a 3 day clinic with Jan Wesen from Washington, who is coming to a lovely farm in Quebec. But try the website below. I noticed one place in Kentucky. I really need to learn my U.S. geography so that I can know which states are close together! Thank heavens we Canadians only have a few provinces to memorize. At least contact a few and they might be able to put you in touch with someone who could help. I agree with Dawn about being hesitant about just spending the day on someone's farm with no lessons. The guy can't think much of his stock if he would let inexperienced people and dogs in with his sheep! We drive over an hour each way for weekly lessons. It is crazy but we all, dogs and people, get so much joy from it that we just can't resist. http://www.ahba-herding.org/MainPage.php?AreaName=FacilityDirectory Hmm, thinking about camps, we should plan that kind of thing sometime, all meeting somewhere for a multi-day clinic!! In the meantime, do some reading and watching videos. There is a website that lists some books and videos. I have never purchased from this site, but it will give you an idea of what is out there. Darn, I wish you lived closer, we could get some videos and open a bottle of wine and watch them! Oh, and you must watch the movie Babe!! http://workingdogs.com/book011.htm |
Mady wrote: The American Herding Breed Association website might be helpful. Or you could come to a herding camp with us some time! We are doing a 3 day clinic with Jan Wesen from Washington, who is coming to a lovely farm in Quebec. But try the website below. I noticed one place in Kentucky. I really need to learn my U.S. geography so that I can know which states are close together! Thank heavens we Canadians only have a few provinces to memorize. At least contact a few and they might be able to put you in touch with someone who could help. I agree with Dawn about being hesitant about just spending the day on someone's farm with no lessons. The guy can't think much of his stock if he would let inexperienced people and dogs in with his sheep! We drive over an hour each way for weekly lessons. It is crazy but we all, dogs and people, get so much joy from it that we just can't resist. http://www.ahba-herding.org/MainPage.php?AreaName=FacilityDirectory Hmm, thinking about camps, we should plan that kind of thing sometime, all meeting somewhere for a multi-day clinic!! In the meantime, do some reading and watching videos. There is a website that lists some books and videos. I have never purchased from this site, but it will give you an idea of what is out there. Darn, I wish you lived closer, we could get some videos and open a bottle of wine and watch them! Oh, and you must watch the movie Babe!! http://workingdogs.com/book011.htm LOL - hey Kim - I posted the AHBA link already!  Clinics/camps are a good idea, but usually they need you to have some basics down before going that route. Also - there are lots of youtube videos out there - but many are pretty crazy. You don't want the dog racing around and making the sheep run. But you can learn from other's mistakes as well. I know I made a LOT of agility training decisions just watching trials and vowing I would avoid some problems I saw others making. Nothing wrong with learning from other people's mistakes!  |
| You just put that link in two seconds ago!! Either that or my broken and old eyes missed it. As for videos, I was thinking more about watching proper training videos as opposed to amateur ones. Karen can watch the one of David getting trampled by sheep if she wants to watch the newbies herding!! But watching the movie Babe is mandatory. You just have to pretend that it is a real sheepdog in the movie instead of one of those border collie posers! |
| Thanks you all! I have checked the site you both posted and the Ky. location is about 2 and a half hours from me, so I am going to call them. I also contacted the Nashville Dog Training Club today and although they do not offer herding classes they do have some contacts and said the would get that info to me. So maybe something a little closer. I do not mind driving to get some basics and some instruction so I will let you know what I find out. Watching videos is a good idea--I always forget that you can find most anything on YouTube and will look and see if there are some good ones, and as Dawn said sometimes there is value to learning from others mistakes. I am interested in maybe doing a clinic at some point and that might be a good way to get together for a 'good reason' Kim! And BABE is one of my favorite movies I will watch it again! |
| Any luck with finding a place to take herding lessons? Good idea checking with the training center - dog people tend to know other experts in the different dog sports. We just got back out after a couple months absence yesterday. Quite the workout for all of us. It was too hot and humid for Chewie - he just wasn't thrilled to be out there (with rules) in the heat! We are really working on new stuff for him - doing a send out and gather. Plus he needs to learn to do it both directions - away to me (counter clockwise) and come bye (clockwise). We are struggling! For Bond the heat was a plus - it tired him enough that after a bit, I had a dog who settled and did some real nice work! Our current project is control...and for Bond that means stopping on command and giving ME the sheep. Well, the heat wore him out enough that after I had him working for a bit, he WAS willing to stop on command!! We repeated it over and over...I hope he remembers! Needless to say, by the time we were done I was a wet and sweaty noodle...and I HATE to sweat... If you want a road trip - our OES Club is sponsoring an OES-only herding day this coming Saturday - in WI. It's at a farm I've never been to, but several of our club members out that way take their lessons there. I'm excited! |
| Sounds like a real workout!! I hate to sweat too and the humidity here is brutal right now! My two older guys, are like Chewie, they detest the heat and humidity--Murphy however doesn't seem to be as bothered by it and he is in full coat, so I do really watch his activity outside because he doesn't stop. Your description of the 'work' does sound like fun, AND...that it would take more than 15 to 20 minutes of instruction for me to know what I am doing! The place listed in Hazel Ky. is an option for us--it is about 2 1/2 hours away. I have a call in to them to get details and see what the schedule is for the next few months. The people that work with herding at the NDTC are supposed to contact me, so far have not heard anything from them but I was told it might be a few weeks before they contacted me. A road trip would be fun--but can't do it this time as we have family coming this weekend to visit! However, I would be more than willing to do a road trip to attend a 2-3 day clinic somewhere. If you hear of anything like that coming up--please let me know. |
| Well now I think I have found the place to take Murphy for herding. The lady from Hazel Kentucky called me back and gave me all the information in regards to their program. She is a fascinating person and I ended up spending about an hour on the phone with her--and I never do that--but I was enjoying her 'story' and she was very willing to answer questions. I am wondering if some of you might know this lady. She is an AKC judge and judges in St. Louis for the herding trials held there. She no longer teaches herding but has a partner who does. Her name is- Dr. Mary Belle Adelman--she has a website http://www.glendhenmere.com I have also spoken to the lady who trains for the herding. Her name is Kim Boster and she was very informative and friendly. This will be a 3 hour drive for us but will be worth it if this is a good program. The plan right now is to go up on Wed. July 9th to work with her and let her meet and work with Murphy. She has suggested that since I will be driving quite a distance every other week, that I should also do some obedience training with her. I am thinking about it as we don't have any more classes locally until the end of August because the facility here does not have AC. She says she has worked with and likes OES. Her accomplishments look very impressive on her website, so I feel pretty good about this--but would still like some thoughts and opinions from those of you who are more experienced with these things. She suggested that she could work with Murphy and I and have us ready to compete in Obedience and Rally at the National Specialty in October. I will stay overnight this time--and then attend the herding lesson on Thursday morning. She has even offered for me to stay the night on her property as she has facilities that she uses when she holds trials at her farm. I thought that was extremely generous, but a little hesitant to accept until I meet her. Since many here have much more experience and knowledge about these things--I would appreciate your opinion. I don't want to invest time going that far if this is not what I am looking for.  |
| I've never heard of her. Maybe Judi has - seeing she goes that way to judge, etc. I would certainly check her out. It seems a plus she works with GSD's and ACD's - neither of these is typically the "easy" breeds. Looked at her website - some of it is really old...but not to hold it against her. Her ACD youngster is adorable  PS - I can mention her at the herding workshop we are having this weekend too. Maybe get some feedback. |
| Thanks Dawn--I know she has been ill but is doing better. See if anyone knows her--I think I am going to give it a go anyway. Can't hurt--and maybe it will be great! |
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