How do you get new people to still show their dogs at Show
Went to a good show on Sundays & once again got good advice from our breeders & lots of help & advice from the other people who were showing. As I am new too the breed & showing as well I cannot see the point of the judge to cheat  . Not that I know alot about OESD & still learning. But when the judge is not looking down the lead but the top of it I begin too wonder. Even myself I could see it was a fix if that is the right word. Its the dog s not the people who enter the shows . The judge need too take a long look at themselves & wonder why the numbers are falling or people leaving. If the dog/bitch had a bad day & thats fine. I do this for fun meet other new people & look at all the great dogs. It cost lots of money too show a dog ( I might as well buy dog food with the money & send it to a rescue place ). By the way we came last but that is fine. 1st or last as long as you are given a fair chance & get beaten by a flat footed dog as well. |
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| While I agree, if you haven't seen this thread http://forum.oes.org/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=35484 read through it - it touches on the same thing along with some other good points made by some veterans. Vance |
Read the post & good points. In the UK they try not to shape the dog & alot less cutting than the US. The point I am trying to make is not about the people & dogs because 99% are great. But the Judges themselves. Before we went went into our breed class myself & Georgi entered the stakes. This is to see how we get on with other breeds & the Judge ( well hit me in the head sideways  ) He came up too her & asked how old & then started to mesure her tail  and said sorry but I do the too all dogs as I like to know how long there tails are. He went over her & then with his hand flattern her coat down , which I stood there with my mouth open & he walks away. The lady next to me with a German shepscratch her head said that was the most daft thing she has ever seen. So I just left the ring & walked away. You would think they would get a judge who had a idea about a vast amount of dogs. Well back to the judges. If they are your mates & your face fits you will do well & people will not turn up if a certain Judge who is judging on the day. This is wrong & what they should do is get pionts on how well they have judged so your can score them after the show or there is someone from the kennal club to judge them. That might get them to judge in a fit & proper way & most of all to be honest. I will shut up now |
| I hate to say this but what you experienced is not just present in the dog world. One of the horse shows I did this past year had two judges out of three which came with a "reputation". As I sat reading over one of my tests which has the judges comments I said something in passing about "is she hallucinating or what?" At least 3 other competitors chimed in stating that the judge has a definite bias against "warm blood type horses" and don't count on getting my needed scores that weekend...... two months after this another member from my club spoke up about an up coming show. She mentioned the judge and said that there was no way she was going to waste her time or money entering the show. I didn't even say anything. Her own opinion and she said the judges name. Needless to say I likewise didn't enter the show. 3 months later and I am speaking with my trainer for herding about trials. She came right out and said that she would help me pick the trials since she knows the fair judges. She knows I do it for fun and don't want to get discouraged. I know that there is no official way to complain about judges in dressage and I am not sure about herding. I understand people have some preferences but I think most judges are able to keep that in check. that being said after years of competing I am starting a list of judges I have had and how we have scored in the past. I will avoid those "questionable" judges since there is no reason to get side tracked when I know based on my trainer and other judges scores and comments where I should be number wise. I think it is worthwhile to talk with your breeder and get their in put. How do they think the pup stacked up against the others. What are their thoughts on that judge? Was it a bad day for the judge or do they not have experience judging OES. |
| Well, from my experience the phrase "It's a dog show!" applies. Anything, absolutely anything can happen. You are paying for that judges opinion and that is what you get. Some judges will often put up a class dog over a special and some judges will never put up a puppy. Then there is the politics -- always and ever present. You have to have thick skin and love what you are doing more than the winning. Unfortunately (or fortunately) the winning is the high that keeps us going back. Having a great group of friends you show with that can support you and help you makes all the difference and becoming a part of a community that all share the love of our breed is what keeps us connected. I love the dog show atmosphere -- the excitement aka stress, the dogs, the travel, being able to get my dog supplies, etc. is what keeps me involved. I have been out for little more than a year and feel very happy to be involved again with a nice puppy. Don't take it too seriously (which I know is sometimes hard) because there is always tomorrow! No dog wins all the time and different judges are looking for different things and some judges just like a pretty picture! So, try not to get discouraged and give it another go. |
| What I can gather Georgi was fine but the issues was with the Judge. If you read this post we was not expecting too much . viewtopic.php?f=10&t=35603 But I can say that apart from the judge it was a good day out. People there were great & lots of fun. brought some combs & brushes. Georgi was fine as the place was very busy so that was a good thing. We will do 1 more show before cruffs & give her a rest & get her coat back to its normal self  |
| Glad that you have a positive attitude and will give it another try. Sounds like there were many good things about the day. Good luck on future shows! |
Parwaz wrote: . In the UK they try not to shape the dog & alot less cutting than the US. ( well hit me in the head sideways ) He came up too her & asked how old & then started to mesure her tail and said sorry but I do the too all dogs as I like to know how long there tails are. He went over her & then with his hand flattern her coat down , which I stood there with my mouth open & he walks away. Dont let what happen put you off, like any competative hobby-sport there is always the good and the bad, as you go along and learn, bloom and get more experience the occassional bad lessens and the good outshines.. Now one point is here in Australia, we dont overshape either. Second point the judge checking the tail, yes we have tails too and completely normal, because of the hair (White Tip) at the end of the tail the judge is checking how far down the natural tail comes. The tip of the tail exluding the hair should reach at least the top of the hock. further up then way too short. Asking how old is what most judges ask especially in the younger classes as in the younger classes there is a variance in the age group and having one that has just progressed to that class and others in that class months older and probably only weeks off advancing to the next age group is why they ask to forgive a lack of maturity to the others in the class they may be a lot younger. Flattening the coat down is normal in this breed also, there seeing if there is a top line, how short in back they are as all OES being judged THEY are a hands on breed, having a lot of overhang-excess coat at the butt can make them look longer when they are not, or poofing up the back coat to create a presence of a top line when one is not there. Hands on is how the breed is judged.  My suggestion is contact the KC and go to show handling classes and learn what is done in the showring and learn the standard so you understand when showing what is going on and what is happening as far as what the judge is looking for and doing as far as a hands on breed with long coats is concerned, I can understand the German Shepard ladies reaction to what the judge did as they have short coats and not any comparison to how oes breed is judged and touched. |
lisaoes wrote: Parwaz wrote: . My suggestion is contact the KC and go to show handling classes and learn what is done in the showring and learn the standard so you understand when showing what is going on and what is happening as far as what the judge is looking for and doing as far as a hands on breed with long coats is concerned, I can understand the German Shepard ladies reaction to what the judge did as they have short coats and not any comparison to how oes breed is judged and touched. Definitely. On our dogs, if they aren't really getting their hands in there, they aren't going over the dog as well as they could. I'd rather have a judge really evaluate the dog and get his or hands all over him and refluff later, knowing that I got a fair look and he cared enough to spend the time to completely go over the dog. Most judges know what they did and you usually have ample time to puff out any flat spots before you have to move the dog again. You just have to get quick about doing it. I will admit, I never got as speedy as I've seen a lot of people but if you can just get the hair back in place so the outline looks good for movement, you'll have more time before the final evaluation. I've also seen judges that get really touchy feely with the dogs when they can't make up their minds between two dogs that are very close. I remember one show that we were at where the judge was between my dog and another one and she went back and forth between us, going up and down the bodies-- more than once. In the end we took breed so all the smashing down of his hair was well worth it! |
| As I said before the advice & help has been great & maybe I have put across I am a total noob & I am in certain ways. But our breeders have advised us alot. So we have gone to ringcraft & lots of shows. I do understand that there has been alot of this type of thing going on for years but why. I am the sort of person to sort things like this out. Level playing ground for us all unless your try it will stay the same |
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