Retraining sit positioning

This is going to sound really stupid but... How do you retrain your dogs sit position? Asterisk was trained in obedience that to sit, she had to face me and she does it perfectly! She always comes right to the front of me and sits.

Now in agility, they want her to be at my side to sit. I can understand so that when I send her over a jump we're facing the same direction. Asterisk doesn't understand she's supposed to be sitting at my side and doesn't want to; she wants to sit facing me.

Does anyone know what steps I should take to break through to her?
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That one actually is a pretty easy fix. A couple different ideas...

1 - pick a new word that means sit by your side. (I love different word commands) For example - many teach "sit" to mean sitting in heel position (at your left side, dog shoulders even w/ your left leg). Then use "front" to mean a sit directly in front of you, you and your dog facing each other. A variation of front is using it as the recall word - meaning for the dog to come and sit directly in front of you when called - "Fido front".

So, just pick a new word to mean sit in heel position. One of my students has one I liked - she says "place" and that always meant sit in heel position, from whatever position the dog happened to be in.

2 - use target training. I love the hand target method. It is very useful.
It basically allows you to move or place your dog wherever you hold the palm of your hand. Dogs really love it - they see it as a game.
8) Just generalize that sit means sit no matter where she is ;-)

Dogs stink at generalizing. I always start out teaching sit in one position. And they get rewarded in that position. So they think sit means "sit in front and stare at face". Then I ask them to sit by my side and they come to my face. So I release them w/o cookie and then position them so they're standing next to me and ask them to sit, and most of them respond by trying to go back to front. Still no cookie. Back to side. Ask to sit. Block forward motion. At which point many of them fall completely apart, but you TOLD me to sit, but you won't let me go there!, and then they threaten to report me for animal cruelty and the whole nine years until I stick a cookie in front of their nose and lure them into a sit WHERE I want them to sit at which point :idea: usually goes off and they realize the world as they know it has not ended. :roll:

After that it gets a little easier to generalize to more positions and they stop fighting you that sit means sit in front of you (which is actually Front ;-) and life returns to happy, happy again.

Till the next time you ask them to generalize something they know beyond a shadow of a doubt means one thing and one thing only!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

My more stubborn ones can be resistant for several weeks. They're not being naughty. They just don't understand.

Macy is VERY big on me not changing the rules on her :twisted: :P :oops: :lol: Oh but there is hell to pay until we can negotiate a new agreement :wink: :lol:

Kristine
Erin, this is easy..... as long as you have patience. :twisted:

Dawn got it right with the different words.

Unfortunately, Kristine got it right too: "But this is the way I have always done it"

Harry is the King of that mentality. You can only imagine how two alphas like Harry and me do combat over all this training. We are about even in score on the battles and the war is still raging on.

He really can press all my "lack of patience" buttons and he doesn't do it on purpose.

Just hang in there and keep working. Frequent short sessions are best. And breaking the training into small steps is more effective then trying to master the whole thing. These sheepdogs love to work and pay in the form of a treat goes a long way towards shaping the desired behavior. A clicker class is always helpful with this concept and can be used to train lots of behavior once the dog understand the click means he got it right. Harry likes being right more than the reward..... I wonder who else is like that? :lmt: .... :oops:

Just treat Wendell everytime he sits no matter where he is facing - even if you don't ask him to sit - once he realizes that then he will start offering lots of sits. Then when he is offering only treat him when he is sitting at your side. Then you can name the behavior. Once he associates the name with the behavior you can ask for it.


Harry's sit words are:
"Sit" - park your butt anywhere (unless we are competing in obedience and rally and then it means at my side where you should be heeling)
"Front" - come to sit right in front of me
"At Side" - next to me to get ready for agility, rally, etc.
can you explain the target training method????
sheepiegail wrote:
can you explain the target training method????


For a hand target, you want your dog to touch the palm of your hand with their nose.

You start off with a lot of treats in one hand, and the other hand is the "target". The dog is loose or at least relaxed - not in any certain position - just standing near you. it is easiest for me to start with my dog facing me.

I use the word "touch" and the goal is that the dog goes wherever that palm is and touches it w/ their nose. It is super fun, and you act like it is a game of tag.

I started by holding my palm up toward my dog and saying touch - and you can even gently touch the nose - then use a clicker or verbal marker (i use a quick "yes") and give them a treat from the other hand. In a few minutes, your dog will be diving for your hand to get the treat from the other. Then you have fun - hold it high and low, move around, go left, right....etc. I also run around and play like tag games - they LOVE it!

Play this game for awhile, then you can start using it. You literally can power steer the dog by the way you hold your palm. If they are sitting crooked in heel position - like facing into you a bit - if you hold the palm out away to the far left, they will straighten out real quickly and think it was all good fun! Or if your dog likes to be just out of reach, this game gets them happy to be close in range (and under control). It encourages and rewards interaction with you.

It is very important to not do the touch and the treating from the same hand - they need to touch, then get the treat from the OTHER hand.

The important thing is to always make it positive, and it will keep it's fun factor for your dog. If my dogs are getting bored, a quick game of touch targets always gets them happy and glad to be part of working w/ me. :D
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